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Follow Along cyrus791's Journey Using Bemob + Mobipium + Popads + Luke's Pops Guide + Evadav

MOBIPIUM

Active member
VIP
Partner
Hey guys, if the
That's a loooong but informative read. I will apply this principles in Evadav push notification offers. My test there looks promising. I might have a winner there. I am thinking that it will take longer for Mobipium campaigns to go green because of poor payout but I am seeing Evadav push notification fixed payouts will give me faster green results.
If the POs are your concern you can ask your dedicated AM to do a traffic quality check and they'll be able to increase the payouts if the quality is good!
 

cyrus791

Member
**July 20**

Here's my results for "test" campaign:
x1.png

Nothing new in here, always red because of broad targeting in Indonesia.



Here's my results for "Android_Chrome_ID_WebsiteID" campaign:
x2.png

This is not a good day for me because it is negative. The ROI is still playing around green and red when I sorted it to hourly.

I'm am playing with the bid to hit the sweet spot. When I hit the sweet spot with the bid I have, the conversions are 100-200 per hour, when it is not getting enough traffic, the conversions are 50-100.

What can I do if I am almost breaking even with this "Android_Chrome_ID_WebsiteID" campaign?
I am -4.83% in this campaign for the last 7 days.
0.59% in the last 3 days.
-8.45% in the last 2 days.

So far, I am targeting the country Indonesia, Chrome 47+, Android, "General" category and WebsiteIDs.

I haven't narrowed down my targeting for category. I think I will do it. My questions is, what else can I do to optimize this campaign?

I'm losing hope but I still think it has a potential.

Any piece of advice in what I am doing is appreciated.
 
Last edited:

Luke

Admin
Staff member
What can I do if I am almost breaking even with this "Android_Chrome_ID_WebsiteID" campaign?
I am -4.83% in this campaign for the last 7 days.
0.59% in the last 3 days.
-8.45% in the last 2 days.
Try split testing a few new offers in there. For example, if you could potentially test adding the Monetizer push collection smartlink. You have converting traffic, but you need it to have a better payout. Maybe the payout for the Monetizer link will be double what you are seeing with the current offers? Only 1 way to know. Split test the Monetizer link in the campaign! :)

IMPORTANT: The Monetizer link will monetize your push subscriber over the course of a few weeks to a month. So, you may not see revenue right away, but let it run for a week or so and see if you have new push revenue coming in 👍
 

servandosilva

Well-known member
Community Leader
Phewww, I just read this whole thread and it's interesting. To me, it seems like your main problems are:

1. You're whitelisting instead if blacklisting, which makes more difficult to optimize campaigns and reduces your volume.

2. You might be whitelisting sites before you have enough conversions. I tend to whitelists sites with 3+ conversions. How many are you waiting for before moving them to a whitelist campaign?

3. Do you blacklist the sites from your RON campaign before moving them to your whitelist campaign? If not, better start doing it to avoid competition.

4. This only applies fo the first 2 pages if this thread, but it looks like you were moving website IDs from a global RON campaign including many geos to a whitelist campaign that was targeting just 1 geo. That is weird and could lead to confusion.
 

cyrus791

Member
Try split testing a few new offers in there. For example, if you could potentially test adding the Monetizer push collection smartlink. You have converting traffic, but you need it to have a better payout. Maybe the payout for the Monetizer link will be double what you are seeing with the current offers? Only 1 way to know. Split test the Monetizer link in the campaign! :)

IMPORTANT: The Monetizer link will monetize your push subscriber over the course of a few weeks to a month. So, you may not see revenue right away, but let it run for a week or so and see if you have new push revenue coming in 👍
I will keep that in mind in the near future. I really want higher payout for push subscription offers. Who doesn't? :)

For now, I will focus on Evadav because I am about to get a cash flow using them next Monday even if its still negative ROI. I can use the funds that are going out from Evadav to fund my daily budget in my existing campaigns. If I'm going to start now with Monetizer, I'll start over from scratch with the cash flow cycle.

Phewww, I just read this whole thread and it's interesting. To me, it seems like your main problems are:

1. You're whitelisting instead if blacklisting, which makes more difficult to optimize campaigns and reduces your volume.
Yes, I am whitelisting in the first place until @jimmyvanilla teaches me to blacklist.

For now, my main focus is whitelisting and I'm seeing positive ROI this July 21st. I will show my results for this date later on.

2. You might be whitelisting sites before you have enough conversions. I tend to whitelists sites with 3+ conversions. How many are you waiting for before moving them to a whitelist campaign?
I whitelist websites with positive ROI in the last 30 days. I don't include websites with negative ROI. Then I get the categoryID with positive ROI in the last 30 days and apply them to my campaign. So, I'm targeting for my campaign right now is, Indonesia+Smartphone+"Chrome47+"+Android+WebsiteID(Whitelist - Positive ROI in the last 30 days)+CategoryID(positive ROI in the last 30 days)

3. Do you blacklist the sites from your RON campaign before moving them to your whitelist campaign? If not, better start doing it to avoid competition.
What I did was, I extracted websiteIDs of my whitelist campaign and blacklisted them in my blacklist campaign. Also, I blacklisted websiteIDs that are costing me money in my blacklist campaign.

Can you please elaborate more in layman's term on how you do blacklisting? I'm still confused on how blacklisting works because I end up blacklisting all websiteIDs from my whitelist campaign and also blacklisting websiteIDs that are costing me money.

4. This only applies fo the first 2 pages if this thread, but it looks like you were moving website IDs from a global RON campaign including many geos to a whitelist campaign that was targeting just 1 geo. That is weird and could lead to confusion.
In my opinion, it is best for me to move WebsiteIDs from 1 country RON campaign to whitelist campaign instead of multiple countries RON campaign.




**July 21**
Here's my results for "Indonesia - PopAds - test" campaign:
y1.png

I changed it from "Global - PopAds - test" to "Indonesia - PopAds - test" to avoid confusion.

In "Indonesia - PopAds - test", I blacklisted all websiteIDs from my "Indonesia - PopAds - Android_Chrome_ID_WebsiteID" campaign. Also, blacklisted websiteIDs that are costing me money for "Indonesia - PopAds - test". I end up getting lower volume because of doing blacklisting.

Here's my result for "Indonesia - PopAds - Android_Chrome_ID_WebsiteID" campaign:
y2.png

I am now seeing consistent green.

Please check when I filter in by hourly:
y3.png


It is improving. What I did to achieve this was to target:
Indonesia+Smartphone+"Chrome47+"+Android+WebsiteID(Whitelist - Positive ROI in the last 30 days)+CategoryID(positive ROI in the last 30 days)

I will still check the consistency of these results before targeting more like, language, cities, state, carrier and more.

That's all for now.
 

Attachments

akahma

Well-known member
Good results, in my opinion this campaign will give you a step by step on how you optimize campaign with low cost and much data :)
, it is best for me to move WebsiteIDs from 1 country RON campaign to whitelist campaign instead of multiple countries RON campaign.
Yes that right
Keep going:)
 

servandosilva

Well-known member
Community Leader
Yes, I am whitelisting in the first place until @jimmyvanilla teaches me to blacklist.

For now, my main focus is whitelisting and I'm seeing positive ROI this July 21st. I will show my results for this date later on.
Why are you waiting for him to teach you?
Blacklisting is just as easy as whitelisting, but instead of adding sites to a new campaign you just block the ones from your current campaign. PopAds show this as "include" or "exclude" sites.

I whitelist websites with positive ROI in the last 30 days. I don't include websites with negative ROI. Then I get the categoryID with positive ROI in the last 30 days and apply them to my campaign. So, I'm targeting for my campaign right now is, Indonesia+Smartphone+"Chrome47+"+Android+WebsiteID(Whitelist - Positive ROI in the last 30 days)+CategoryID(positive ROI in the last 30 days)
Do you have 30 days of data? O see you started this follow along 7 days ago.
It's good if you're not including sites with negative ROI and conversions, as long as you have enough ad spend to back it up.

If you're whitelisting sites already, I feel like whitelisting categories doesn't make any sense here. The sites are already categorized and you will just receive traffic from such websites, why whitelist categories?

What I did was, I extracted websiteIDs of my whitelist campaign and blacklisted them in my blacklist campaign. Also, I blacklisted websiteIDs that are costing me money in my blacklist campaign.

Can you please elaborate more in layman's term on how you do blacklisting? I'm still confused on how blacklisting works because I end up blacklisting all websiteIDs from my whitelist campaign and also blacklisting websiteIDs that are costing me money.
You just said above you didn't know how to blacklist sites... this is confusing 🤨

I normally just blacklist the websites that don't work and that's it.
I only use the strategy you use (blacklist unprofitable websites + blacklist working sites and create a new whitelist campaign with them) when nothing else works. I don't like that strategy and leave it as a last resource mostly because:

1. It tends to reduce volumes a lot and I like profitable campaigns with high volumes.
2. Many times when you create a whitelist campaign the websites that are working in your RON campaign stop working there. Even if you have the same bids, since your bids are kept on average within the range you're bidding, you end up losing traffic or having to bid way higher to reach the same performance.
 

jimmyvanilla

Well-known member
Community Leader
I am whitelisting in the first place until @jimmyvanilla teaches me to blacklist.
It sounds like you're currently doing both blacklisting (global campaign) and whitelisting (WebsiteID). I think it's simpler to just blacklist. This is what I was sugesting here:
Alternatively, if you're happy to keep testing one Argentina campaign, what you could do is:
  1. Stop both WebsiteID and WebsiteID1 campaigns
  2. Go back to your data from your Global campaign and find all the publishers for Argentina that:
    1. Have terrible ROI that you're happy to cut forever
  3. Start a new WebsiteID2 campaign targeting Argentina and exclude (blacklist) the bad websites
  4. Exclude Argentina from your Global campaign going forward
With this approach, what you're going to do in the future is:
  1. Keep excluding (blacklisting) websites that don't work out from your WebsiteID2 campaign
If you're whitelisting sites already, I feel like whitelisting categories doesn't make any sense here. The sites are already categorized and you will just receive traffic from such websites, why whitelist categories?
I agree with this. Just blacklist websites, otherwise if you cut the categories you're cutting other websites that might be ok.
 

cyrus791

Member
Why are you waiting for him to teach you?
Blacklisting is just as easy as whitelisting, but instead of adding sites to a new campaign you just block the ones from your current campaign. PopAds show this as "include" or "exclude" sites.
I meant he gave me some insights on how to do it and I am applying it but I end up cutting up my volume when blacklisting all websites that cost me money and with positive ROI websites.

Do you have 30 days of data? O see you started this follow along 7 days ago.
It's good if you're not including sites with negative ROI and conversions, as long as you have enough ad spend to back it up.
I just sorted it by 30 days in my tracker to get all the data. Yes, I just started more than 1 week ago.

If you're whitelisting sites already, I feel like whitelisting categories doesn't make any sense here. The sites are already categorized and you will just receive traffic from such websites, why whitelist categories?
You got a point there. I was thinking it might be helpful to get more conversions. So, do you suggest to just target all of non adult categories then?

You just said above you didn't know how to blacklist sites... this is confusing 🤨
I don't know how to do it properly. I am trying to learn from my mistakes.

1. It tends to reduce volumes a lot and I like profitable campaigns with high volumes.
I got the same experience. It definitely reduced volume when blacklisting unprofitable websites + blacklist working sites.

2. Many times when you create a whitelist campaign the websites that are working in your RON campaign stop working there. Even if you have the same bids, since your bids are kept on average within the range you're bidding, you end up losing traffic or having to bid way higher to reach the same performance.
This is good to know. That's what I am experiencing. What do you do in this situation?

It sounds like you're currently doing both blacklisting (global campaign) and whitelisting (WebsiteID). I think it's simpler to just blacklist.
Yes, I'm doing both. When you say it's simpler to just blacklist, I only run 1 blacklist campaign and start pausing my whitelist campaign?

I agree with this. Just blacklist websites, otherwise if you cut the categories you're cutting other websites that might be ok.
Both @servandosilva and you said suggest it. I think I am going to revert the changes I've made.

Good results, in my opinion this campaign will give you a step by step on how you optimize campaign with low cost and much data :)

Yes that right
Keep going:)
Thank you @akahma.

**July 22**
Here's my results for "Indonesia - PopAds - test" campaign:
sw1.png


The volume goes down a lot because I blacklisted unprofitable websites + blacklist working sites. My bid here in "Indonesia - PopAds - test"(blacklist campaign) is $0.0001511 and my bid in "Indonesia - PopAds - Android_Chrome_ID_WebsiteID"(whitelist campaign) is $0.0001811. What are your thoughts with this setup? Do you think it will create confusion with bidding with myself?


Here's my result for "Indonesia - PopAds - Android_Chrome_ID_WebsiteID" campaign with a bid of $0.0001711:
sw2.png

Today is negative ROI.
The changes I've made to get these results are:
1. I created two campaigns.
2. I named the 1st one "Indonesia - PopAds - Android_Chrome_ID_WebsiteID_CategoryID_Cellular_WebsiteID2_CategoryID2" campaign which means it comes from "Indonesia - PopAds - Android_Chrome_ID_WebsiteID" campaign. I sorted it by "CONNECTION-TYPES: Cellular" in Bemob then I extracted positive ROI websiteIDs and CategoryIDs from it. That's why this campaign "Indonesia - PopAds - Android_Chrome_ID_WebsiteID_CategoryID_Cellular_WebsiteID2_CategoryID2" is created. My bid here is $0.0002171.
3. I named the 2nd one "Indonesia - PopAds - Android_Chrome_ID_WebsiteID_CategoryID_Cable/DSL_Unknown_WebsiteID2_CategoryID2 " campaign which means it comes from "Indonesia - PopAds - Android_Chrome_ID_WebsiteID" campaign. I sorted it by "CONNECTION-TYPES: Cable/DSL" in Bemob then I extracted positive ROI websiteIDs and CategoryIDs from it. That's why this campaign "PopAds - Android_Chrome_ID_WebsiteID_CategoryID_Cable/DSL_Unknown_WebsiteID2_CategoryID2" is created. My bid here is $0.0002171.

Sorry, it has a lot of names of the campaign here. :)

I think I will eliminate these 2 campaigns I just created because the results are not good for my "Indonesia - PopAds - Android_Chrome_ID_WebsiteID".

My question is:
Is it really going to affect the performance of this campaign: "Indonesia - PopAds - Android_Chrome_ID_WebsiteID" when I have other campaigns with higher bid and targeting the same websiteIDs and categoryIDs?
 

akahma

Well-known member
My question is:
Is it really going to affect the performance of this campaign: "Indonesia - PopAds - Android_Chrome_ID_WebsiteID" when I have other campaigns with higher bid and targeting the same websiteIDs and categoryIDs?
According to your setup
And each siteid placements
It can vary and give you different results
Depends on each variables if these , either alone or combined
1- your frequency capping of each campaign
2- your traffic loss of each siteid / campaign
3- how many Landers/ offer you work with
4- activity of each siteid/ with the percentage of it's unique Vs raw traffic
According to these data you can get different results :)
 

cyrus791

Member
According to your setup
And each siteid placements
It can vary and give you different results
Depends on each variables if these , either alone or combined
1- your frequency capping of each campaign
2- your traffic loss of each siteid / campaign
3- how many Landers/ offer you work with
4- activity of each siteid/ with the percentage of it's unique Vs raw traffic
According to these data you can get different results :)
1. My frequency capping is 1 view/24hours for "Indonesia - PopAds - Android_Chrome_ID_WebsiteID" campaign. Do you have any experience on which frequency capping works best?
2. How can I fix traffic loss?
3. I only have one lander which is "Play Video 2"
4. How do you know the activity of each siteid?
 

akahma

Well-known member
My frequency capping is 1 view/24hours for "Indonesia - PopAds - Android_Chrome_ID_WebsiteID" campaign. Do you have any experience on which frequency capping works best?
Each campaign has different approach, also if it profitable , increase frequency may increase its ROI and may not it will be according to your data and judgment,
For you now as you are using 1/24 for you're two campaigns, it's exactly as running one campaign with frequency 1/12 hours

For click loss , I don't mean to fix it , I mean to check it why??
To calculate how much traffic you get from each placements and how much you lose and if so increasing frequency or running two campaigns will compensate the loss "if placements are profitable"
To check it , check how many impressions you get for each campaign on popads , and it's crosspending on bemob , andafter that check statistics of Evadav,
For example , you get 10000 from popads ,
Reached bemob 9000 and final evadav 8000
You have 2000 click loss , but that in your calculations,
And as you are using one lander , increasing frequency / double campaigns will not be ofuch value as the same impressions will go to the same lander over and over

For checking each placements activity or data you can check it on popads by running report with site IDs, and status of each it will give a statistics of each site "raw traffic, unique traffic, categories, etc , also from you tracker you can check the complete data of impressions you get from specific site id
 

cyrus791

Member
**July 23**
Here's my results for "Indonesia - PopAds - test" campaign:
aq1.png


Here's my result for "Indonesia - PopAds - Android_Chrome_ID_WebsiteID" campaign:
aq2.png


I think I will stop making changes to my campaigns every hour I see negative ROI and just take a look at the whole day performance instead of hourly.

Do you think it is recommended to create new campaigns for each positive ROI WebsiteIDs?

I mean for example, I will name my campaign "Android_Chrome_ID_WebsiteID_4108049" and based on the name, the campaign on PopAds is going to target Android, Chrome, Indonesia, and WebsiteID: 4108049. It will have a low volume but it is very targeted. Like the elements of this WebsiteID has 4%+ conversion rate, positive ROI.
 
Last edited:

Nick

Well-known member
Community Leader
I think I will stop making changes to my campaigns every hour I see negative ROI and just take a look at the whole day performance instead of hourly.
😲

If you're making changes every hour that's very bad. You need to make data-backed decisions.

You might even look at longer data timeframes than just 1 day to optimize, but obviously, if there are sites that are just spending and not converting block them.

As others have mentioned a blacklist approach is probably going to be best for you. Spend 2 - 3x payout (since the payouts are very low) to test a siteID. If no conversion block it. After you have a bunch of data on other traffic variables... like browser, OS version, etc., then you can consider removing some of them from your campaign.

Do you think it is recommended to create new campaigns for each positive ROI WebsiteIDs?
If you want, but consider this:

Would you rather have 1 campaign that does $50/day profit or 50 campaigns that do $1/day profit?

The more you split up a campaign into many campaigns the more work you're creating for yourself. Sometimes there's a good need to make a single site campaign, such as if it's a high volume placement and you're trying to milk it for every penny you can get out of it.
 

cyrus791

Member
After you have a bunch of data on other traffic variables... like browser, OS version, etc., then you can consider removing some of them from your campaign.
I never have thought of that. I actually have some Chrome versions that are spending a good amount of money without a single conversion. I'm going to remove these.

Would you rather have 1 campaign that does $50/day profit or 50 campaigns that do $1/day profit?
I would rather have a single campaign with $50/day profit. It makes sense. 50 campaigns will give me a lot of work.
 

cyrus791

Member
**July 24**

Here's my results for "Indonesia - PopAds - test" campaign:
sz2.png

I am not getting any volume here because I blacklisted positive ROI WebsiteIDs and non profitable WebsiteIDs.


Here's my results for "Indonesia - PopAds - Android_Chrome_ID_WebsiteID" campaign:
sz1.png


I didn't make any changes to this campaign for the whole day. I will let it run again for another day without touching it. Let's see if it will go green again.
 

cyrus791

Member
**July 25**

Here's my results for "Indonesia - PopAds - test" campaign:
sa1.jpg


Here's my results for "Indonesia - PopAds - Android_Chrome_ID_WebsiteID" campaign:
sa2.jpg


I didn't touch it during this day.
 

servandosilva

Well-known member
Community Leader
Almost there, but at a low volume. Is your budget $5 per day?

Have you noticed any other patterns that might not be performing well for you in your whitelist campaigns?
Besides checking websites now you can now blacklist browsers, OS, categories, etc.
 

cyrus791

Member
Almost there, but at a low volume. Is your budget $5 per day?

Have you noticed any other patterns that might not be performing well for you in your whitelist campaigns?
Besides checking websites now you can now blacklist browsers, OS, categories, etc.
My budget is $30/day but it is not spending all of it. I think it spends $5-$10 per day.

I noticed some OS and browser versions that are not performing well. It has zero conversions. That's why I removed them from my targeting
 
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